Re: Can you *believe* this guy? (AGGGHHH!!!)

Liberty (
Wed, 17 Jun 1998 23:10:24 -0400


At 02:49 PM 14/06/1998 -0400, Graeme Bacque wrote:

>Oh......?  Since these are necessities of life rather than luxuries, I feel
>they should be considered unconditional rights. Certainly no human being

It is one thing to say these are unconditional rights, and quite another
to find a way of paying for it.

>Are you saying that persons who aren't (for whatever reasons) assisting in
>the corporate goals of maximizing profits at any cost not entitled to their
>liberty or the basic needs of life? It's hard, if not impossible, for anyone 
>to 'better themselves' in a climate where basic needs are almost impossible 
>to meet, and you face constant blaming and other abuse for situations beyond 

Most people are able to meet their basic needs, and do not ask for handouts.

>your control. It is neo-conservative politicians, the corporations who give 

I always find it interesting when anybody speaks about "corporations".  How
big does a company have to be to become a "corporation".  Does it include
any small company, including one-person firms, that are incorporated? I
just don't understand how the radical left operationalizes their philosophies.

>them their marching orders - and people like yourself who are apologists for 

Another thing is interesting here ... you say "corporations" are giving
politicians marching orders.  How can a "corporation" do this?  A corporation
is a legal entity, not a real entity, not a real person ... how can something
that only exists on paper give anybody any marching orders?

>this ongoing violence - who are irresponsible; not those who are struggling 
>to survive on a daily basis. 

What responsibility does someone else have to pay for somebody else's living?
What is the intellectual justification for this?

>Provision of needs is an obligation in any society which insists on a
>centralized governing structure - and it shouldn't involve intervention in
>personal lives; merely listening to identified needs and ensuring the
>availability of necessary resources. 

If somebody wants the goods and services, there is always a price.  Pay
the price, and get your basic needs met.  If you don't want to pay the
price, then you risk not getting your needs met.  This is reality, where
rights are tied to obligations of citizenship.

>The smarmy false moralizing and massive social control which accompanies the 
>meagre resources actually made available is unnecessary and unacceptable.

You're hopelessly tied to your ideology, are you not?

>personally I long for the day when people reclaim their own lives to a
>where the bosses, politicians, and their apologists like yourself get tossed 
>out on their fat and useless asses.

I think I reclaimed my life to a large extent when I became a so-called
"boss" (your word), and also helped many other people reclaim their lives
as well: I gave them good jobs for decent pay, no unions.  The kind of
I was able to create for myself through my hard work certainly surpasses
that which would have been provided me, if I had been forced onto welfare,
and therefore, under somebody else's control.