Re: NCH and the Amarican Homeless Society

P. Myers (
Tue, 23 Dec 1997 16:22:40 -0800 (PST)

Absolutely agree, said it so well...feelings of frustration
and anger may be shared as such...without maligning others... Pat M

On Tue, 23 Dec 1997, Virginia Sellner wrote:

> We need to be able to agree to disagree without theattacks on each other
> that seem to emanate periodically from AHS towards people that they don't
> even necessarily really deal with.  It is a waste of time and energy.  That
> time and energy could better be spent on a positive note rather than
> continual negativity.  Look for the good -- it is there in everyone.  We
> can't conquer anything with this divisive attitude projected by some.  Virginia
> At 02:01 PM 12/23/97 PST, Wandering Bear wrote:
> > My particular defenition of free speach is pretty fluid itself.
> >Just what is the facts to be faced here?
> > Ive often found that it takes two to tango?
> >The thing that The amarican homeless society is against the most is 
> >"poverty pimps" Those who take money for the homeless than put it in 
> >their own pocket while giving very little to the homeless as they can.
> >Then treet the homeless as third class citezens.And I agree with him on 
> >it.Organizations who do this should be stoped.
> > Is this what he's saying N.C.H. is doing?
> >If it is I need to know that this isnt happening.
> > In most shelters Ive been in the homeless are treated like 
> >prisoners,while the staff live and eat in luxury that what payed for by 
> >donations to the shelter.Im shure you would agree that this in not an OK 
> >situation.The American Homless Societies main reason is to put an end to 
> >this.
> > Can we agree that this is nessissary?
> >Peace Love and Light:)
> >Wandering Bear
> >
> >
> >
> >>Wandering Bear, on the surface this sounds great.  But conflicts are
> >>not truly resolved by refusing to face facts.  And the facts are that
> >>there IS no war on the part of NCH.  The "war" is wholly and absolutely
> >>instigated, fueled and maintained by the American Homeless Society.
> >>It is impossible for the NCH to "reconcile" with someone who is
> >>determined to fight with them.
> >>
> >>When Ruben and Sharon show the ability and willingness to talk with --
> >>instead of at -- and to work with others, then you can ask others to
> >>work with them.  But you are going to have a lot to do with Sharon and
> >>Ruben first, before you reach that point.
> >>
> >>Ruben and Sharon have an amazingly fluid definition of "free speech".
> >>They characterize their own vicious attacks as "mild constructive
> >>criticism", and howl whenever they are told to lay off.  But my offer
> >>to publicly post any documentation anyone has to refute Sharon's
> >>charges they call "character assassination".  When I posted
> >>documentation refuting Mike Lee's charges against SHARE, Sharon took
> >>the brave stand for free speech of refusing to accept any posts from
> >>me any longer, and objecting when my posts showed up on other mail
> >>lists. 
> >>
> >>I will always call anyone on inaccurate statements, especially if they
> >>are malicious inaccurate statements.  This is not "war".  This is
> >>responsibility.
> >>
> >>It is not pacifism to refuse to call a lie a lie.  It is not love to
> >>let people continue destructive and self-destructive behavior without
> >>calling them on it.  It is not productive to the homeless/activist
> >>community to let people spread false and malicious charges and not be
> >>called on their behavior.
> >>
> >>This *will* happen, repeatedly.  This has not been the first time that
> >>someone has tried to make themselves out to be a hero by dragging
> >>someone else down, and it won't be the last time either.  The cleanest
> >>way to deal with it is not by "negotiating", but by clearly stating
> >>the facts.
> >>
> >>The only reason I commented on Sharon's post was to keep any innocent
> >>bystanders from being misinformed.  That is the intention of everyone
> >>else, including Chuck Currie, Virginia Sellner, Michael Stoops, myself
> >>and Tim Harris -- prevent the spread of false information, and make
> >>source information available -- the kind of thing that can be 
> >independently
> >>verified, a standard Sharon and Ruben notably lack in application.
> >>
> >>I do agree that this fight is uneccessary and harmful.  Therefore I
> >>suggest you concentrate on getting the American Homeless Society to
> >>find a more productive use for its energies.  The rest of us already
> >>have.  In spite of its monumental size in the world of Ruben and
> >>Sharon, this "war" of theirs occupies very little of my life or that
> >>of any of their named "enemies".
> >>
> >>There is no way short of the heat death of the universe you are going
> >>to please both sides in this conflict.  Don't try.  Take the stand that
> >>you believe is right, and take responsibility for following through on
> >>it.
> >>
> >>_________
> >>~~ Anitra
> >> for a full list of 
> >websites
> >>and webrings because if I list them all here, you will be SO mad at me 
> >...
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >______________________________________________________
> >Get Your Private, Free Email at
> >
> >
> Virginia D. Sellner - Wyoming Coalition for the Homeless, P. O. Box 1232,
> Cheyenne, WY 82003-1232,   email:    URL: