all of the above

Barbara Grier (
Wed, 01 Apr 1998 23:37:05 +0000

HI gang 

I'm sorry I don't have to much time to write these days or read for that

but I have skimmed the last 60 postings and boy such a lot that I would
like to add. A few more thoughts  ......I have just sniped a few things
from that I have read and felt...
*a goody*
Virginia Sellner wrote:
> More and more people in all kinds of situations that "put them at a
> disadvantage" in society are beginning to stand up for themesleves and
> demand their rights. 

The Sad Thing here is that *they* *(anyone)*would have to demand any
basic human dignity the right to shelter???
How much darkness excists in the souls of mankind along side so much
beauty and light.....

>I just came from a meeting of self advocates who have
> disabilities, some mental some physical and they can do amazing things for
> themselves -- things that no one ever thought in years gone by that they
> could do.   One of their goals is to get everyone out of institutions -- and
> give them moral support etc. while they are learning to speak for themselves
> and stand up for their rights.

to be able to "speak for oneself" how simple this seems to some, what a
mountian to others
> Isn't that the only way that homelessness will end? 

It sure is big on my list of thing to overcome....finding ones own voice
not an easy thing if you never had it before......... 

> BUT the key thing here
> is work TOGETHER.  And it seems to me that even among the homeless there are
> too many view points -- the goal should be to close all shelters, and
> provide sometype of housing for everyone -- of course -- but if we don't
> work together it won't happen.

How right you are, unity....but how to find this among so many....the
common threads
In the cities where we all live our homeless family gather in small
groups and past greetings of sorts to each other.words of
encouragement...dreams for a better tomarrow or today.....we show
comunity the need for community....our best effort to keep thing in the
*normal* realm.
another goody :)
Tom Boland wrote:
> FWD Tue, 31 Mar 1998
> CC Replies to author: John Hilty <>
> Subject: Re: On Poverty and Crime: Oscar Wilde's views [by John Hilty]  FWD
> Liberty wrote:
> > and when did the hard-pressed taxpayer ever consent to having his or her
> > hard-earned money used for people that will not work, or bother to further
> > their own capacities for self-support?
> >
 The boundary between taxpayers and the homeless is fluid,
 not a brick wall, as you are portraying -- many of the homeless
 DO work, or they have been taxpayers in the past and expect
 to receive government services when they are in need during
 the present.  Furthermore, many people who have never been
 homeless in the past, will be surprised to find themselves homeless
 sometime during the future, including possibly yourself -- who

> FWD River City News [Jacksonville,. FL] March 14, 1998
>     Story last updated March 12, 1998
> By Orlando De Bruce
> Staff writer
> Downtown> 
> FWD River City News [Jacksonville,. FL] March 14, 1998
>     Story last updated March 12, 1998
> By Orlando De Bruce
> Staff writer
> Downtown community leaders had to put off discussion this week on how to
> stop people from feeding the homeless in Confederate Park.

Community leaders meeting to stop feeding the hungry.....shouldn't this
really read community leaders meet to find ways to feed the hungry
has anyone ever thought of changing out all the decoritive plants that
adorne city buildings in every *town and village* and plant some thing
that could be *eaten* by the hungry and homeless after all if your tax
dollars are to be used for plants shouldn't they really benifit the
public......of course 

> Two members of the Urban Core Citizens Planning Advisory Committee who were
> assigned last month to meet with the food providers and come back with a
> report did not attend the group's Tuesday meeting, said Phil Neary,
> chairman of the Urban Core panel.
> The group wanted to meet with Good Shepherd Outreach Ministry to discuss
> moving its food service operation out of the park and into a building.
> Because of conflicting schedules, that meeting never happened, said
> committee member Carlon Robinson.
> ''We're still on the feeding at Confederate Park issue,'' Robinson said.
> ''We've been at this for a year now. It's been tiresome. I'm about fried
> with it.''
> had to put off discussion this week on how to
> stop people from feeding the homeless in Confederate Park.

How do these people sleep at night?

Imagin you get a tax break for low income housing but you don't get a
tax break if you live in low income housing .....what is wrong with this
picture....Income Propert info commercials scare the ---- out of
me.Anyone eles?

 How many of you have lived at or known someone that lived at an
apartment for years same owner never fixed or replaced
a thing then as soon as they moved the whole appartment was
remodled..and if the tenent left on bad terms for what ever the cause
the land owner try and many time wins the remodling cost at the expence
of tenent which just pushed another human down again...or a as *they*
say it is time to clean house. These same land owners advertive for
section 8 applicants in the daily papers.....these are the things that
keep the homeless or nerly homeless at the mercy of the systems
.....that people could crave so much for themselves that many could be
denied a space any space.......

*A baddie*
> Las Vegas Review Journal, Wednesday, March 11, 1998
> Associated Press
>       RENO -- The removal of homeless camps along the Truckee
> River is down to a few final shoes and blankets. Now, deputies will
> start patrolling the banks to ensure the squatters stay away.
>       "We'll check the river on a daily basis. If anybody comes in
> behind us and sets up camp again, we'll offer them services and
> assistance," Washoe County Sheriff's Sgt. Bob Towery said on
> Tuesday.

Yes I really believe you (we'll offer them services and
 assistance,") assistance right out of town?or to jail?or?
too, too many together and we can still see them. Move them somewhere
eles Some place out of Site out of Mind......and one they don't choose a
space for the view or the lovely trees and grass they choose to be part
of a community even if the greater community seems to think they don't
deserve basic human rights.....because *why* thousands and thousands of
reasons to answer this one single question.....each one personal to its
carrier...each with choises and limitations real and imagined in the
mind eye of its beholder................
Can't anyone of these fine people see that all they are asking for is a
place to be a place to regroup ones thoughts.....The shock of being on
the street has killed hundreds is it the intention of the all city
officials that more should end their live in these simalar ways and
reduce the surplus population....(Scrooge by.C Dickens dose anyone know
the date of that novel? See this is not a new problem.....;-) Just an
old DENILE....

*A Baddie*

> March 12, 1998
>   Santa Rosa [CA] Press Democrat Bureau
> PETALUMA -- The city's homeless community, shaken after the fatal shooting
> of a transient by a police officer Tuesday, is fighting a drive sparked by
> the shooting to rid a Petaluma neighborhood of its services for the needy.
> The homeless community expressed regret over the death of 41-year-old Paul
> Bryant Rodrigues, who was shot twice by Petaluma Officer Roy Loden. Police
> said Rodrigues charged Loden with a metal bicycle part during a burglary at
> a homeless center.
> A group of the homeless and needy gathered in Kenilworth Park near the
> Petaluma library Wednesday because the nearby soup kitchen was shut, still
> surrounded by police tape.

 Here ithe kicker

> ""There's anger, there's confusion,'' said Richard Shockley, a friend of
> Rodrigues. ""I can't believe this has happened.''

How hard is this not to believe,really......sad really sad:(
The cream of the crop ..........

 Subject:      Screw the homeless
> From:         JRW <>
> Date:         1998/03/22
> Newsgroups:
With so many wonderful replies to this I feel sure that we are moving in
the right direction....with out a strong wind a plane can not lift
itself from the earth to soar...
This just makes me more determined to search my own soul for answers on
a daily bases to reach out to anyone that comes my way.....We need a
Human Revolution....each looking at our own role we play here.letting
our faith equal our daily life and encouraging any that will have the
openness of mind and heart to do the same.

Liberty wrote:
> > I have nothing to do with bringing [the homeless] into this world.  I support
> > myself and my family, which is to whom I have direct responsibility.
> >Tell me,
> > where in the US constitution (or any other constitution of the free
> > world) does it say that I am obligated to support other people who will
> > not work, and any children they bring into this world?

Tom wrote:
 We are accountable to the higher morality of natural law.  There
 exists a genetic similarity between yourself, your spouse,  and
 your children.  You also share a genetic similarity with other
 members of your species, and you owe your entire existence to
 the collective success of this species.  Therefore, you have a
 higher social obligation to provide material support to other members
 of humanity when they are in need.

Tom Thanks for truth I belive Liberty you would come to the same
conclusion if you were to find yourself and family in the same homeless
Working homeless how absurd!!!! Open your eyes wide and see what is
really real.

Well I know I said I didn't have much time but some how we all make the
once we found our voice. A voice is a terrible thing to waste...  :)

Thanks for the space,